Watch the subtitled video above if you prefer to listen to my advice.
In this video we’re going to talk about men going their own way. MGTOW. Maybe you’ve heard about this movement. The reason why I’m making this video even though, obviously, I’m a dating coach who wants to help you to have a great relationship with a woman… So men going their own way seems counterproductive, but I think it does make a lot of sense for a lot of men.
I got a message from a 24 year old young man and he has a lot of dating problems, and he basically gets rejected all the time, and he doesn’t really know how to attract women, and so I think the men going their own way movement has some good sides.
Obviously, if you have the approach of “yeah fucking screw women and I’m not gonna date them and I’m just gonna go my own way, and not date anyone at all, I’m just gonna focus on myself“… obviously, then you’re not going to score with women. But everything can be applied with moderation and I think there are some great ideas and concepts and mentalities that we can actually get and pick up from MGTOW. So let’s look at his message and then let’s see what I think about his struggles.
No Confidence As A Man: I Was Bullied In High School And Have A Lack Of Confidence And Self Esteem
Hi Coach Andy. I’m 24 years old and to begin I was always rejected and bullied as a kid just because I was a little bit overweight, and wasn’t good at sports unlike many other kids. As a conclusion, I grew up very shy and with barely any friends.
That is very understandable. Actually, I have the same background. When I was younger I got bullied in school so all of the bullies they called me names, and they pushed me around and I didn’t really know how to have boundaries, and protect myself, and stand up for myself. And that actually came from my father.
My father, even now, he’s 65 years old. He still doesn’t really stand up for himself. So we often model these things based off of our parents, and if we don’t have role models to show us how to stand up for ourselves, then we have these problems, especially in childhood, but also a lot of men have these issues even in their adult lives when they’re unable to stand up to women. Obviously, if you’ve been bullied in the past, that makes you feel very insecure and these insecurities, they shine through in your dating life.
So my best friend was the computer (video games for the win).
Same for me by the way. Diablo 2 for the win!
No Confidence With Women: How Can Shy Guys Get A Girlfriend When They Don’t Know How To Flirt?
And I was so shy at the point where I could barely form a verbal sentence when talking to someone outside of my small group of friends and family, and eye contact was the worst.
So I had the same issue probably until I was 25ish, 26, 27, as well with eye contact. I struggled a lot with having eye contact with women but the thing that you need to learn about eye contact is that actually, nobody really gives a shit about you.
Nobody has an opinion about you. So, for example, if you’re thinking about having eye contact and maintaining eye contact with women to flirt with your eyes, the reality is first of all a lot of women just don’t give a shit in the sense of they have some opinion about you… it could be good or bad, but they don’t really care, because they are literally going to be gone in a minute from now and they will never see you ever again. So that’s one thing it doesn’t really matter what opinion a woman or any person has about you.
So just practice the eye contact and force yourself to do it. And then the second thing is also, well, do you realize how many women there are on this planet? How many incredibly beautiful women are on this planet? You can literally practice eye contact with any woman, every three, four, seconds. So if it doesn’t work out, well next woman here, and you can try it out again, until you gain the confidence to maintain eye contact. So don’t beat yourself up. Don’t judge yourself. Because you’re talking yourself into being judged because obviously, you’ve been bullied as a kid. So it’s normal to think that everyone is judging you and thinking there’s something wrong with you but it doesn’t really matter. Nobody’s judging you.
Some people judge, you but it doesn’t really matter. Most people are too busy with their own problems, and with their own lives, or with their own boyfriends, and girlfriends, and they just don’t care. So just practice the eye contact don’t worry about this stuff.
And my classmates always exploited my shyness to make fun of me and to make me feel horribly. To be honest I hated school for this reason.
Yeah, that sucks. But now you get to create a new life. You’re no longer in school, I’m assuming at 24 years old. So you are in charge of your own life now so these shit people that you’ve had to deal with in the past… You can say no to them now, okay? You no longer are stuck in school. You can choose your environment. And if you meet someone who’s disrespectful, then you can just walk away and tell them “hey, I don’t like this.” Either you walk away, or you build up the confidence, especially to tell people “no this is not okay” you don’t like to be treated this way.
Accountability In Dating: Being Bitter After Rejection Is A Recipe For Disaster & Leads To More Dating Failures
In high school I had my first rejection in love. I used to like a girl, but since only the nerdiest nerds… not meaning it as an insult. They were good friends, after all…
So since only the nerdiest nerds were my friends, I didn’t have anyone to ask for advice. I don’t want to get into details about how it happened but it was weird and she instantly blocked me and even though I didn’t say anything rude or weird, to be honest, she was quite a spoiled, rich girl.
So you’re probably doing a lot of deflection and projection here. And you’re just butthurt that she rejected you. First you like her, but then all of a sudden she is a spoiled, rich girl. Yeah, maybe she was a spoiled, rich girl. But it doesn’t change the fact that you did something wrong. Most likely with your approach. I mean you’re saying it yourself that you were very socially awkward, you got bullied and all these things, and that was in high school.
So I’m assuming back then you were even more socially awkward than you are right now. Don’t blame this woman for your misfortunes, because if you do this, you’re going to have more failures in life. You’re going to have more failures with women. That’s part of the game. If you want to become good with women, you’re going to have to fail and if you blame the women for your failures, you will never improve, because sometimes it’s the woman’s fault. It doesn’t always have to do with you. The truth is some women just don’t care about you and that’s just how life works.
But that doesn’t mean that you need to blame these women. These women are not your enemies just because they’re not into you. They just have different interests, or whatever. Physically they’re not into you. You don’t have what they are looking for. Doesn’t matter. That doesn’t mean that we have to be mad at them, just move on and move on to the next woman who might be more interested, okay? And keep on working on this. Don’t blame the women for your failures.
How To Make Women Obsessed Over You: Why Wearing Your Heart On Your Sleeve Is Bad With Girls
The same happened in uni when I asked the girl out I had and still have a crush on her for a long time. Having a bad experience from high school, I stuttered and failed miserably because I was too honest. We talked a little since then and since that happened I tried, and tried, and I tried to meet new girls but something about me is freaking them out. And I don’t know what.
So actually, I just remember this really funny story about me that just relates so much to this. I still remember the first time that I was in the Philippines. I live in the Philippines for the most part, or in Indonesia. And the first time that I was in the Philippines, I saw this gorgeous woman and I tried to find the courage to talk to her. And I was alone. She was a singer and I was just so mesmerized by her. And I was so freaking socially awkward and I probably would have had a shot with her actually, but I totally turned her off.
So I really understand this feeling where you just constantly overthink everything, and this is essentially what you’re doing. You’re overthinking every step, every word, that you’re saying. And the reality is, doesn’t matter so much if a person likes you. If a woman likes you, she’s gonna help you out as long as you don’t screw up too much. She’s gonna forgive you for your mistakes.
Sometimes we get all get nervous. We all screw up sometimes. But if she likes you, she’s gonna forgive you for this. Actually, sometimes women find it charming. Obviously, if you’re completely beta and you’re screwing up like crazy, that’s not charming. They’re not gonna like this. I’m not gonna lie to you. But if you are confident, have the courage to talk to a girl, and you have a little bit of insecurity, she can kind of tell that you’re going out of your comfort zone.
She’s not automatically going to reject you because she’s going to respect that you’re still making the move. So don’t overthink so much, because in the end, a woman wants you to succeed. If a woman is attracted to you, she’s gonna be happy that you approached her. Just don’t overdo it with your awkwardness, obviously, and that’s where the practice comes in. And so we’re gonna get to this in a moment where your biggest issue is and why I think you should be going your own way.
But I’m A Nice Guy: Why Women Reject You — She Thinks You’re Not Special & She Owes You Nothing
I try to meet new girls but something about them is freaking themout. I get rejected even on tinder by the extremely few matches that I ever get. And don’t get me wrong, I’m neither creepy, nor ugly, nor messy. Actually, I personally consider I’m decent looking and I have a nice personality. Pretty much the mysterious intellectual type. I think it just happens for me to have almost no interaction skills.
So well, if you have no interaction skills then you are kind of creepy and people will think that. They probably will not think that you are the mysterious intellectual type. They will think “well this guy can’t keep a normal conversation up and going”
I saw this really funny video earlier when I was doing some research for my youtube videos and I actually just googled for… I youtubed… googled youtube (LOL) for my own channel because I wanted to check something, and there was this video about some fake dating gurus and all that stuff. And there was this one dating guy. He’s a pickup artist. So his focus was pick up artistry and walking over to women. And this video exposed these fake gurus, and how they don’t know what they’re doing. And there was this guy and he was shown talking to a woman and he was just so freaking awkward. And this guy is a pickup coach.
So I’m not even an infield expert. I’m not a pickup artist expert who focuses primarily on cold approach with women in bars or just wherever you meet them. In the grocery store, and so on. I can talk to women but I’m definitely not as good as some of these super crazy good infield experts and conversation experts like probably, Tripp Kramer is really good at this stuff. You probably have seen his channel but this guy, this coach in this video, he was so bad at talking to women and they reminded me of the fact that we often don’t realize our shortcomings.
So obviously, if you would be a pickup coach and you’re trying to teach how to talk to women. A cold approach infield, if you’re just seeing a woman across the street and you want to talk to her, and you can’t get even that done and you’re being socially awkward… that’s really no awareness essentially.
So I’m just saying, even a dating coach, even a pickup coach can have zero awareness how he is just horrible actually with talking to women. We tend to always overestimate ourselves and that’s why you should have other sources. Other sources of feedback that tell you honestly what you’re like and what your weaknesses are right. So for example me, I have an accountability partner. My best friend. And we talk about so many things every single day.
We meet up in the morning for quick call to just talk about random shit and our goals and what we want to get done for the day. He’s my accountability partner and one part of that accountability partnership is we hold each other accountable for our bullsshit when we bullshit ourselves and don’t get things done, or when we’re not being disciplined enough, or when we are falling short on our goals, and these kinds of things.
You need people who tell you the real truth about you. You don’t want to surround yourself with people who just tell you all the nice things that you want to hear, because you’re not perfect and you know you obviously have some issues with your approach anxiety. And so you are probably giving yourself a little bit too much credit, actually. And there’s nothing wrong with really realizing “hey I’m actually really bad at this and no, I am not the mysterious intellectual type that women fall for, and I am actually probably a little bit creepy.“
But there’s nothing wrong with that because you can change that. Just because we realize that there’s something that we need to work on doesn’t mean that we are a loser, or a bad person, or whatever. Actually, that’s really a dope thing to realize “hey I need to work on myself” and this is why I also like the men go in their own way movement because even though I don’t completely agree with the thing that you know you should just completely abstain from women…
Some… A lot of MGTOWers do this… I still appreciate the approach of focusing on yourself and working on your shortcomings, because when you work on your shortcomings and if you apply yourself, and improve yourself, you become more skillful. And if you become more skillful, you win in life, with women, in dating, career, anything. Anything. Investments. Spirituality. Enlightenment. All of these things. The more that you focus on yourself, the more skills you build, the better your life will become. And that’s why it’s great to focus on yourself and not so much on women.
You Should Go Your Own Way: Staying Single To Work On Yourself Is Perfect To Learn How To Talk To Women
I can’t take it any longer. I have developed an addiction to alcohol because of this. I am an unhappy person. And my only respite is the alcohol. I barely have any sleep at night and I barely eat. I hate my life so much. The worst thing is that nobody ever told me what I am doing wrong and how to fix that. Instead, they dump me like garbage and they don’t give me a single chance to prove myself.
Well, yes. You see, nobody’s there to give you all the answers in life, except for coaches like me obviously. Everyone is busy with their own lives, so a woman who rejects you, she has better things to do than to tell you “hey this is why you’re being creepy.“
First of all: That’s awkward. She doesn’t want to do that. She doesn’t want to deal with the conflict and why should she? She doesn’t even know you. So why would she put herself into this uncomfortable position of telling you what you’ve been doing wrong when she can just move on to the next guy? And so I can tell you’re having a hard time. Obviously, your alcohol addiction is really tough and you should ask yourself why do you have this addiction? Obviously, the bullying and all of this stuff, and your codependency, how you’re trying to please people really affects you, especially with women.
So the fact that you are not good at this is causing you to become addicted. And what is an addiction? It’s basically just a valve where we let our frustrations out because we don’t think we have a better solution. How to work on our problems. So a lot of people, for example, since we’re talking about MGTOW, and there’s all of these things in the manosphere… red pill, and so on…. They often get this impression on the internet, especially on the more liberal side, that these movements are very, very toxic and that they are misogynistic, and just a lot full of losers, and people who just can’t reflect on themselves, and just are looking for excuses.
And there is some truth to that statement, of course. Because there’s always people who are looking for excuses to not succeed with life. And looking for escape valves. Everything can become an escape. That’s why also in the red pill community, and in the MGTOW community, and in the pickup artist community, and everywhere, there’s always going to be some men who use these really great ideas from these movements just to basically bitch and whine and not work on themselves.
But ultimately, these ideas in these communities are not bad. It’s certain groups of people who turn them into bad things because they apply them wrong. And so your alcohol is no different. Your alcohol addiction is no different from a person who’s very deep into red pill, or men going their own way, who is an incredibly strong woman-hater. There’s not much of a difference. It’s just looking for a way to deal with the anger and the frustration.
And so obviously, like I said: There’s nothing wrong with the red pill movement, or the MGTOW movement and as long as you stay on the healthy spectrum you can really improve your life a lot with these ideas. You just need to find the courage to get back on track. Just like some people get really deep into red pill and turn a bit into woman-haters, but then at first they feel enlightened, but the more they get into it, they feel like women-haters, but the more that they get into they realize “wow, I’m actually maybe a little bit too deep into this and I’m a bit too biased with my approach” and I should take a step back and take some actionable decisions to improve my life.
“How can I use all of these ideas to actually improve my life, instead of just looking at all the negative sides of these movements?” So I understand that your alcohol addiction is really, really tough but the problem is you’re basically using this as a means to avoid the rejection and having to work on yourself. I know it’s not easy. Obviously, when we get rejected and when shit hits the fan, it’s so easy to escape to things that are more comfortable. It’s really about the comfort zones. About the thing that makes us feel better. It’s about relieving stress. Distress.
And some people have alcohol, some have drugs, some have porn, some have masturbation, some have deeply toxic views in some of these communities that I just mentioned, and you have to become aware that you can replace this negative focus that you’re having right now with something more positive.
The Benefits Of Staying Single As A Man: Should Men Go Their Own Way? Yes, For A Time To Sort Life Out
Now I can’t even make eye contact with any girl, let alone start a conversation with her, or behave naturally around her. I don’t even try approaching new people in fear of being rejected. What should I do about that? How, where, under what circumstances should I meet girls if you’re willing to explain? Like you would explain to somebody learning basic human interaction behavior. I really want to get a chance with someone. A decent being. I’m not that desperate and I’m not gonna lower my standard forever. Thank you for your patience, and sorry if my email makes no sense, or has bad grammar. I don’t mind going to therapists. I tried it and it didn’t help me at all.
So yeah, I think a therapist might be able to help you with your codependency issues that you clearly have, but I think what you’re actually missing more is the experience and realizing that all of these things are not so bad. So you think “I can’t even make eye contact anymore with any girl and I can’t even start conversations” and it’s just generally that you are afraid of rejection. And so I think what you need to do is…
This is where we come in with the men going their own way movement or the idea the concept you need to stop focusing on women and you just need to start focusing on generally just interacting with people. So my favorite advice that I always give, obviously depending on your country, it’s a bit difficult, but the best thing always is go to latin dance night. Salsa. Because you get to dance with beautiful women. But it’s not about the women. It’s actually just about the dance and the fun.
And yes, it’s a super nice bonus when you get to dance with an incredibly gorgeous woman and you get to touch her and she’s just in her beautiful dress or whatever she’s wearing, and you’re just so mesmerized by her, and you’re dancing with her. That’s a nice bonus! But the really great thing about this stuff is actually you just learn to socialize. Could also be anything else.
The point is go somewhere where you don’t feel like you need to prove yourself. So the reason why this salsa approach and advice works so well is because in the beginning, when you go to salsa nights, you feel like really awkward, especially most men don’t know how to dance. Me as well. I didn’t know how to dance. And first time that you go there, especially the first time you’re like you’re just staring there and you’re watching everyone dancing. You’re feeling so awkward and helpless. But then all of a sudden, there’s a woman who asks you to dance and you didn’t even expect that.
Because women are actually quite happy about this because they’re always looking for dance partners. And slowly you realize that this stuff is not so bad, and you can actually do this. And it was all in your head. And like everything, social interactions, talking to people, and just having some random conversations about whatever, it really is just a matter of realizing that these things are not so hard.
Basically, what people tell themselves is that everything in life is like a test. It’s like a test in school. If you’re talking to some people they’re grading you with… are you an A+ plus on the conversational skills, or are you a D+ minus? And sure, obviously, if you’re super awful, that is a bit awkward for people. Especially in the beginning when you’re still getting started. But once you reach a base level of normalcy of being able to talk to people and just have some basic conversations with people, people don’t give a shit anymore. They just don’t care and they just love talking to you.
You always see this in circles of friends and groups, that there’s one person who’s quite socially awkward, very shy but not crazy socially awkward. Then there’s this other guy who’s super extroverted and can talk for hours. It’s a spectrum, and people don’t judge you if you’re more on the spectrum of being more introverted. The bottom line is just need to be able to hold a basic conversation, and that just starts with practice.
And so you have to find some ways how you can talk to people and probably just men. Or ways that have nothing to do with dating and women at all. So like I said it could be salsa, it’s nice because there’s women included there. But you don’t feel the pressure of dating or seeking the approval of a woman, actually. They actually give YOU approval because they want to dance with you, so that’s why it’s so nice. But it could also be that you pick up a new hobby that’s dominated with men, for example, one way how you can meet men and just meet random people, also women, but also just men in general…
So you go to something like bouldering. It’s a great way to just hang out in the bouldering hall. You don’t have to interact so much with people. You just get to climb by yourself. Bouldering, if you’ve never heard of bouldering, it’s like that thing where you climb up rocks without any security mechanisms and sometimes you just strike up a conversation with someone.
It has to be something where there’s probably not too many people, because once you, for example, if you’ve ever been to a gym, you probably know how awkward it feels to strike up a conversation with someone because it feels like everyone is doing their own thing and because so many people, you feel like someone is looking at you if you start talking with someone else. So you want to do something that has interactions with people. So I’ll wrap up this video. I think this wraps up everything that I wanted to say.
Start with some basic conversations and don’t focus on the women. Go your own way and focus on yourself for a while.
